Home Forums General Panels, Components, Macros Next panel to come: Ensoniq FIZMO

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This topic contains 22 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by Syn-Fi Syn-Fi 2 years, 2 months ago.

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  • #20220
    jasefos
    jasefos
    Participant

    Howdy CTRLR Freaks!

    Just letting you know that my next CTRLR project (once I’ve completed the Roland MPG80 mk2 which I’ll be publishing shortly which now will edit both Upper and Lower tones simultaneously) will be for my beloved weird old 90s digital transwave synth, the Ensoniq FIZMO.

    Just thought I’d post here to see if there are any other FIZMO owners on this forum whom would be interested in testing builds, etc, or contributing other expertise (lack of skill with LUA scripting is my main weakness which I’m getting to grips with).

    There is much functionality this synth offers which cannot be accessed from its front panel unfortunately (even though it is festooned with knobs) which can only be accessed from the included Sound Diver OEM adaptation.

    I’ve virtualised a Windows 7×64 installation on my Mac Book Pro with VMware and have been studying the MIDI output streams in the MIDI monitor and indeed, this one is going to prove a challenge! In particular, when changing Insert effect algorithims, a really long SysEx dump is sent to the synth – the size of the message would lead me to assume that Sound Diver dumps the entire patch when changing effect algorithms.

    Unfortunately I cannot locate any kind of MIDI SysEx Implementation for the FIZMO (the user manual lacks this) and so my primary means of building this panel will be via studying Sound Diver output. [sighs!]

    Anyhow, most likely I’ll be basing the GUI around the face of the rack version – thankfully I found a really good front on hi-resolution image for it which I’ve attached to this post.

    I may even do the Ensoniq DP4 at some point as well.

    Cheers!

    JaseFOS

    Attachments:
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    --> Music: www.soundcloud.com/jasefos
    --> DAW: OSX10.10.5 with Live 9.6 x64, UA Apollo Quad
    --> Controllers: Push 2, KeyLab61, Maschine mk2, MCU Pro, 2xMCU-Ext
    --> Synths: Cyclone Bass Bot TT303, ESQ1, MKS80/MPG80, Matrix 6R, Matrix1000, Mopho, 05RW, DW8000, Virus TI Polar, Voyager Electric Blue, MiniBrute, AN1X, K5000s, FIZMO, ASR10 rack, Kenton ProSolo (controls Sequential Pro-One, Yamaha CS15), Prophecy, EMX1, MonoTribe, SP1200, DX100, KARP Odyssey

    #20261
    opuswerk
    opuswerk
    Participant

    If you do the DP4 / DP2 you would definitely be my hero. I meant to work more on ctrlr panels, but i really lack time at the moment.

    http://opuswerk.tumblr.com
    www.soundcloud.com/opuswerk
    www.facebook.com/opuswerk

    #20336
    Syn-Fi
    Syn-Fi
    Participant

    This would be cool but the DP4+, DP-Pro and the Fizmo seem to have incomplete Sysex spec. There is a Fizmo user group on Facebook and there also one on yahoo, although that group does not seem so active.

    #20337
    Syn-Fi
    Syn-Fi
    Participant

    This link might help you and give you some background on the sysex spec that is available
    : http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.audio.emagic.sounddiver/17611

    #20452
    jasefos
    jasefos
    Participant

    Syn-Fi – thanks for your info. The FIZMO manual is of little help in terms of SysEx implementation that’s for sure! I have Sound Diver communicating successfully with the FIZ via a VMWare virtualised instance of Windows 7 on my Mac Book Pro and can watch the data fly back and forth in its MIDI monitor. It’s going to be much more complex a job than the MKS80 but hey, a CTRLR panel will make this synth a heck of a lot more useful to me.

    --> Music: www.soundcloud.com/jasefos
    --> DAW: OSX10.10.5 with Live 9.6 x64, UA Apollo Quad
    --> Controllers: Push 2, KeyLab61, Maschine mk2, MCU Pro, 2xMCU-Ext
    --> Synths: Cyclone Bass Bot TT303, ESQ1, MKS80/MPG80, Matrix 6R, Matrix1000, Mopho, 05RW, DW8000, Virus TI Polar, Voyager Electric Blue, MiniBrute, AN1X, K5000s, FIZMO, ASR10 rack, Kenton ProSolo (controls Sequential Pro-One, Yamaha CS15), Prophecy, EMX1, MonoTribe, SP1200, DX100, KARP Odyssey

    #20467
    Syn-Fi
    Syn-Fi
    Participant

    hi,
    there is also this but it may put you off, or give prevent you getting stuck:

    http://sequence15.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/fizmo-project-progress-report.html

    #20532
    jasefos
    jasefos
    Participant

    Well that was an insightful read and would explain why I’m having issues making sense of the MIDI SysEx activity that is coming from Sound Diver (weird byte packing, etc). Perhaps I will attack this synth later as my CTRLR experience and skill improves.

    Cheers

    JaseFOS

    --> Music: www.soundcloud.com/jasefos
    --> DAW: OSX10.10.5 with Live 9.6 x64, UA Apollo Quad
    --> Controllers: Push 2, KeyLab61, Maschine mk2, MCU Pro, 2xMCU-Ext
    --> Synths: Cyclone Bass Bot TT303, ESQ1, MKS80/MPG80, Matrix 6R, Matrix1000, Mopho, 05RW, DW8000, Virus TI Polar, Voyager Electric Blue, MiniBrute, AN1X, K5000s, FIZMO, ASR10 rack, Kenton ProSolo (controls Sequential Pro-One, Yamaha CS15), Prophecy, EMX1, MonoTribe, SP1200, DX100, KARP Odyssey

    #27595

    xmario
    Participant

    any news?

    #27685
    jasefos
    jasefos
    Participant

    No progress of yet I’m afraid.

    I got as far as studying the SysEx streams which the OEM Sound Diver adaptation sends the FIZMO when changing FX algorithms, etc … each tweak would produce hundreds of bytes of SysEx data make it difficult to spot the changing parameter (I’m assuming the entire patch is being dumped).

    I’ll return to this one when time/patience permits.

    For the moment however I’m working on an improved version of Atom’s Mogue Voyeur Panel (most importantly the advanced parameters in the menus for things like Glide Modes, etc) since I’ve just been lucky enough to be given a Moog Voyager for my 40th birthday thanks to a large pool of my kind friends.
    ; )

    --> Music: www.soundcloud.com/jasefos
    --> DAW: OSX10.10.5 with Live 9.6 x64, UA Apollo Quad
    --> Controllers: Push 2, KeyLab61, Maschine mk2, MCU Pro, 2xMCU-Ext
    --> Synths: Cyclone Bass Bot TT303, ESQ1, MKS80/MPG80, Matrix 6R, Matrix1000, Mopho, 05RW, DW8000, Virus TI Polar, Voyager Electric Blue, MiniBrute, AN1X, K5000s, FIZMO, ASR10 rack, Kenton ProSolo (controls Sequential Pro-One, Yamaha CS15), Prophecy, EMX1, MonoTribe, SP1200, DX100, KARP Odyssey

    #41096

    jojjelito
    Participant

    Did anything further get done with this? Do I understand it right that each parameter change means that the entire patch gets transmitted?

    #42863

    klapton
    Participant

    I have a FIZMO and can take a stab at it. I have most of the RPN/NRPN parameters mapped out. It’s been a while since I’ve looked at Ctrlr. I didn’t fare well with it on my Mac. But I’ve since switched to Windows and will give it another go.

    #44492

    xmario
    Participant

    would be great to see some progress.
    found this website
    http://www.thesoniq.com/
    “THESONIQ is the only one authorize service center
    by EMU .I work at ENSONIQ factory for many years
    and i am the only one left who is still service ENSONIQ
    unit here.”

    maybe its possible to get some help from them.

    #45047
    paulfury
    paulfury
    Participant

    Hi all. I’m a Ctrlr newbie. I own an Ensoniq DP/Pro – at some point I had planned to maybe try and tackle that – no idea if I’m up to it, am planning on building my first panel for another simpler piece of gear but haven’t started yet so my comments should be taken in the light of the fact I have zero experience with Ctrlr.
    Like seemingly everyone else I can’t find the Sysex implementation notes. Am I right in thinking the Fizmo shares some commonality with the Dp-Pro? If so I’m guessing it might be possible to use some of the Fizmo info for a jumping off point…
    Anyone got any Sysex info for the Dp/PRo or the Fizmo they’d be willing to share?
    I’m going to email thesoniq and see if they have anything.
    Cheers all
    P

    #45105
    Puppeteer
    Puppeteer
    Participant

    I’m pretty sure I’ve got the full DP4+ SYSEX spec at home. You had to send away for it. I’ll see if I can dig it up. I’ve only got the DP2 in the studio at the moment and may look at a panel for that in the future, once I can solve my problems with my Kurzweil PC3 panel

    The Puppeteer
    http://godlike.com.au

    #45118
    paulfury
    paulfury
    Participant

    Thanks Puppeteer, although I suspect they retooled it all for the Dp/Pro as it was on the newer ESP2 hardware. I thought the effects from the Fizmo were supposed to be related to the DP/Pro but I might be wrong?
    Sure lots of people would LOVE a DP/4 editor though, there are loads around and it’s a great unit….

    #45119
    Syn-Fi
    Syn-Fi
    Participant

    Not sure there is a complete spec for DP4+ so that would be most welcome. There is one for DP4. Dp/Pro is very different from the DP4 line. Whilst the algorithms sometimes have the same names and even the same modifiers its different. ESP2 is on both DP4 and DP/Pro but its a smaller fabrication on the DP/Pro and probably a bit quicker. This is covered in the ESP2 assembler document.

    Fizmo has Dp/Pro effects and if you want the DP4 effects get the TS10/12. Really, though you should get the DP4+. I think a lot of the Fizmo’s character comes from the effects and whilst the DP/Pro has nicer delays and a smoother reverb it misses the grainy quality from the Dp4 and most of all it misses the meaty phaser, flanger and chorus. Datarro who designed many of the algorithms for the DP4 did not work on the DP/Pro but clearly the DP/Pro is inspired by the DP4 as it has that unique ‘cross-regen’ in the delays, something that isn’t found on other delay programs.

    On the Ensoniq Paris group someone ported the Dp/Pro reverb over as well as the DP4 reverbs so the assembler, coding and engineering is still out there.

    #45120
    paulfury
    paulfury
    Participant

    Hi Syn-Fi,

    Thanks for that. I thought the DP4 and DP4+ were ESP and the DP/Pro, DP/2 and Fizmo were ESP2? Shows how little I know 😉

    Jon Dattoro famously reverse engineered and published one of the Lexicon reverb algos too (he worked for Lexicon before Ensoniq) – the main verb in the DP4 is heavily Lexi 224 related. Lexicon sued him unsuccessfully, and Dave Griesinger even acknowleged that the algo was right-on.

    He told a friend of mine by email that while he didn’t work on the DP/Pro he thinks they probably reused his code as a jumping-off point and then developed it further – reverb engineering can be a LOT of work, that stuff doesn’t just fall from the sky 😉

    I’m wondering if the Sysex for the effects int he Fizmo might relate to the DP/Pro? Pure guess/desperation. Thesoniq.com doesn’t have the documentation either.

    Got a few more people to try and ask….

    Thanks all. Sorry for the OT discussions – hope the Fizmo panel goes well, always liked that unit.

    Cheers all,

    P

    #45122
    Syn-Fi
    Syn-Fi
    Participant

    Yup the court case is up on the WWW to read as well as Datorro’s AES paper. Separately, i have a 224 and i can attest that the character of the 224 is spot on but it misses the ‘size’ of the 224 which comes from the transformer coupled output, beyerdyanmic input and the Cauer 4558 network – this on the plates. This is why the UAD can’t come close to the 224 despite what you read. The Dp4+ is amazing effects machine and its up there with the H3000 which these days sells for £900-1000, twice as much as the DP4+. The problem with the DP4+,Dp4 is reliability but you can fix the power issues and put in better regulators.

    re. Dp/pro heritage: Datorro told me the same think, in not so many words. Something along the lines that it takes man-years to make these algorithms and you can’t start from zero.

    Have you tried the Ensoniq Paris group who seemed to have a lot of background information and help, courtesy of E-mu when they terminated Paris prematurely. Unfortunately there is no one left at E-mu to provide that kind of help for Ensoniq let alone for Emu samplers and RFX-32.

    #46755

    klapton
    Participant

    I’m still working on documenting all the NRPN values. By my best guess, there are 104+ parameters per oscillator. Then 4 sounds with 2 oscillators each. So there are over 825 parameters covering just the sounds/oscs. Then there are over 50 global parameters. I have documented NRPNs for over 300 parameters so far that are controllable from the front panel knobs. The rest will take trial and error with sending NRPNs and reading SYSEX to compare against parameter changes in SoundDiver. I’m guessing there are a lot of hidden NRPNs to match all the available SYSEX parameters. The FIZMO is a beast.

    There’s no doubt this will require a fair amount of Lua to make more than just a basic panel. And I only have a cursory knowledge of Lua, so I have a bit of a learning curve ahead of me.

    #51058
    jasefos
    jasefos
    Participant

    Once I’ve finished my current project (Ensoniq ESQ1) I’ll return to the FIZMO.
    I guess what stopped me was that when I examined Sound Diver output to the FIZMO, when tweaking its FX parameters, the entire patch was being transmitted via SysEx. This wouldn’t be such a problem once I understand LUA scripting enough so that I can parse bulk dumps to Modulators back and forth.

    My immediate ‘need’ for CTRLR Panels for my synths is motivated by wanting total recall of patches I make stored within DAW projects via Snapshots (liberating any reliance on managing internal memories). The ‘blast a snapshot’ at a synth and creating new sounds from an initial snapshot unique for each DAW project has been enjoyable for the past year or so. That level of integration hasn’t demanded creating LUA scripts yet. It’s time I stopped being lazy and roll up my sleeves so to speak. I eventually want all the panels I make to be able to parse SysEx dumps and write back to memories if need be.

    Anyhow, dear thread, I’ll get back on to FIZMO when I’ve started getting jiggy with LUA.

    --> Music: www.soundcloud.com/jasefos
    --> DAW: OSX10.10.5 with Live 9.6 x64, UA Apollo Quad
    --> Controllers: Push 2, KeyLab61, Maschine mk2, MCU Pro, 2xMCU-Ext
    --> Synths: Cyclone Bass Bot TT303, ESQ1, MKS80/MPG80, Matrix 6R, Matrix1000, Mopho, 05RW, DW8000, Virus TI Polar, Voyager Electric Blue, MiniBrute, AN1X, K5000s, FIZMO, ASR10 rack, Kenton ProSolo (controls Sequential Pro-One, Yamaha CS15), Prophecy, EMX1, MonoTribe, SP1200, DX100, KARP Odyssey

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