Problems installing on macOS Sierra

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This topic contains 18 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by  Mr.ToR 2 months, 3 weeks ago.

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  • #72500

    eisenhower
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    Running the Ctrlr-x86_64-5.4.16.sh shell script produces a folder Ctrlr, and the executable Ctrlr-x86_64. When I try to run this I get the error:

    exec format error: ./Ctrlr-x86_64

    soooo whats going on? Do I need to build this from source? (I can’t get that to work either when building the Xcode project)?

    #83983

    Mr.ToR
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    I started using Ableton Live 10 and since it doesn’t work on Yosemite, I had to upgrade to Sierra from Yosemite. Since I’ve tried High Sierra before on another mac and it had speed problems (it also does a firmware upgrade without telling you) I didn’t upgrade my trashcan model MacPro to High Sierra.

    I have Live v9.7.1 as 32 bit and 64 bit also Live v10.0.1 (it is 64 bit only)

    Since I’ve upgraded to Sierra, the panels are not working smoothly when they are a plugin.

    When Ctrlr is either AU or VST, a restricted AU or VST, in any of the above-mentioned versions of Live, it does not work smoothly. Even the Ctrlr editor interface becomes sluggish without any panel loaded.

    As a standalone restricted app or as a panel in the standalone ctrlr editor it works fine.
    So the problem is with the plugin versions of the Ctrlr.

    I guess we need a Mac Update for the Ctrlr or a solution for this problem.
    Is anybody else having this problem with Sierra?
    Is anybody having any problems in High Sierra?
    I wonder if it works ok as a plugin in High Sierra?

    Please help…

    #83988
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    • ★★

    The .sh file is for Linux OS. Though MacOsX is based on NetBSD – a UNIX based OS like Linux it won’t run code made for Linux. There is a special MacOs version:
    http://ctrlr.org/nightly/Ctrlr-5.3.198.dmg

    To MrToR:
    For testing purpose I am using a virtual Mac on VMWare with Live 9.7.1 installed. I always update the MacOs to the newest available version actually it is 10.13.4. Of couse the virtual Mac is not very fast – e.g. it lacks hardware 2D/3D graphics acceleration. Ctrlr does not react very fast but if I remember well it was about the same on Yosemite. For me it has quite acceptable speed performance – not very fast but far from being unusable. BTW: in contrast to Windows-OS Ctrlr and all plugin instances are loading instantly on MacOsX. On Windows Ctrlr delays startup of any DAW considerably. Because of that I would say that Ctrlr for Mac performs better than Ctrlr for Windows.

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by Possemo Possemo.
    #84035

    Mr.ToR
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    Hey Pal,

    Nice to hear from you.
    Thnx a lot for the information. I recently developed a decent amount of paranoia towards apple.
    The problem is that there used to be a separate update for firmware/EFI (extensible firmware interface).
    Apparently since 2015 silently the firmware update became part of the operating system upgrade.
    I did not have issues with Sierra regarding performance but I tried High Sierra with one of my older mac minis. Upgrading the OS and thus upgrading the EFI/firmware made the mac mini very slow so even when I downgraded the OS to Sierra later, because there is no way to downgrade the firmware, my mac mini stayed slow. 🙁

    I believe the firmware/EFI update/upgrade would present no effect on a Virtual Environment. Most probably it would silently fail due to not finding a compatible hardware.

    So I’m really scared of upgrading the OS to High Sierra on my studio device which is a pimped up thrash bin model Mac Pro. Currently, it’s on Sierra. I know upgrading it to High Sierra will render some plugins and some software incompatible also. However, if Ctrlr is not working properly with Sierra and if it’s working properly on High Sierra, I wouldn’t mind the Hassle provided it will not slow my mac down.

    I’m just afraid that the same performance issue will be present.
    I will make a video of this issue and provide a link here to make it clear.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by  Mr.ToR.
    • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by  dasfaker.
    #84037

    Mr.ToR
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    Hey Pal,

    Nice to hear from you.

    Thnx a lot for the information. I recently developed a decent amount of paranoia towards apple.
    The problem is that there used to be a separate update for firmware/EFI (extensible firmware interface).
    Apparently since 2015 silently the firmware update became part of the operating system upgrade.
    I did not have issues with Sierra regarding performance but I tried High Sierra with one of my older mac minis. Upgrading the OS and thus upgrading the EFI/firmware made the mac mini very slow and even when I downgraded the OS to Sierra later, because there is no way to downgrade the firmware my mac mini stayed slow. 🙁

    I believe the firmware/EFI update/upgrade would present no effect on a Virtual Environment. Most probably it would silently fail in the background due to not finding a compatible hardware.

    So I’m really nervous about upgrading the OS to High Sierra on my studio device which is a pimped up thrash bin model Mac Pro. Currently, it’s on Sierra. I know upgrading it to High Sierra will render some plugins and some software incompatible also. However, if Ctrlr is not working properly with Sierra but if it’s working ok on High Sierra, I wouldn’t mind the Hassle provided it will not slow my mac down.

    I’m just afraid that the same performance issue will be present on High Sierra too.
    So I’m just curious about the reason for this performance issue with Sierra.

    I will make a video of this issue and provide a link here to make it clear.

    #84038
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    • ★★

    If you want I can makea a video as well to compare performance. I don’t know a lot about Mac’s I just can tell you how it goes on Windows PC’s (which I do know quite well). Let’s take the example of upgrading a PC from Windows 7 to the latest build of Windows 10. You can install Windows 10 on top of Windows 7 and it may work but in many cases you will at least get degraded performance compared to the “correct” method: First install the latest bios (firmware). With the advent of UEFI bios’es this became even more important. Then do a clean install of Windows 10 which means deleting the system disk completely including all disk partitions – windows will recreate them automatically during install procedure. Install is done from a bootable USB-stick.

    Maybe a similar procedure could be done on a Mac. As MacOsX is based on NetBSD (about the same as Linux) I think a clean install could be advisable.

    #84039

    Mr.ToR
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    I’ve just checked on a clean installed Sierra on my MacBook Air and it has the same performance issue.
    I will now upgrade this Mid-2012 13-inch MacBook Air to High Sierra and post here if it behaves any better.

    #84040

    Mr.ToR
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    here is a video showing the problem

    below is the description from the video

    The first part shows the performance problem when ctrlr is a plugin.
    The second part shows proper performance of ctrlr in app format.
    The same problem applies to panel in ctrlr as plugin or restricted vst/au in plugin host.
    This problem occurs in Sierra. This problem is applicable to any panel.

    https://youtu.be/RcjADIEfGfI

    I’m sure this will make the problem very clear.
    This happens to any panel so it’s a big deal.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by  Mr.ToR.
    #84042
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    to give a quick answer: the performance on my virtual Mac is about in between your sluggish and your fast screencapture. What DAW are you using? I heard that Live10 changed a lot of things related to plugins. My PC is about as old as your Mac (probably from 2012) but it was a high performace desktop computer at the time. I do assign 2 CPU cores and 8 GB Ram to the virtual Mac. When I find the time I will make a screencaputre.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by Possemo Possemo.
    #84045
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    screencapture, plugin on Live9:
    https://youtu.be/7gyO2oOQBWg

    screencapture, standalone:
    https://youtu.be/4a68RlfPKLk

    As you see there is no big difference between the plugin and the standalone version. It is not blazingly fast but IMHO it is acceptable performance.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by Possemo Possemo.
    #84048

    Mr.ToR
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    It’s almost impossible to use your MKS-70 panel now :-(.
    I’ll try another plugin host now. thanks for that idea 🙂

    #84049

    Mr.ToR
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    wow that’s amazing.
    I’ve just tried http://ju-x.com/ (Hosting AU – microDAW – Free!) as a plugin host.
    It’s a 589 KB simple host and the Ctrlr plugin/panel worked incredibly smooth.
    What I don’t understand is why is it slow on my older version of Live?
    It used to be fast on it and the only thing different now is the OS.
    Very confusing.
    I will also try it on High Sierra when the installation completes on that laptop.

    #84050

    Mr.ToR
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    I’ve upgraded my MacBook Air to High Sierra and the performance problem is still there.
    Maybe I should also try this on Logic.

    Also, I should mention that after upgrading to High Sierra, the general performance of my 2012 MacBook Air did not get worse, it actually got a small bit better than before.
    Harddrive write and read speeds are almost same (writes a bit faster and reads a small bit slower) I mean read was 450MB/s now it’s 444MB/s. Also Write was 389MB/s now it’s 393MB/s. and geekbench shows High Sierra gives the best overall score compared to Yosemite and Sierra. So that’s that!

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by  Mr.ToR. Reason: added upgrade info
    #84054
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    I’d recommend Reaper as host for Ctrlr. It is not free but it is very cheap for what you get – and then, you can even try it “forever” the only limitation being a nag screen at startup. I haven’t tried it on Mac but on Windows it works flawlessly. It is the only DAW that I know of which allows full integration of the Ctrlr plugin. I made a tutorial on how to setup the Ctrlr plugin:
    http://roet32.wixsite.com/ctrlr/tutorials
    You probably know all the bla bla bla I wrote about MIDI in general so just scroll down to the screenshots (Live, Reaper and Cubase). Well, I don’t know if Reaper performs the same on Mac as on Windows.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by Possemo Possemo.
    #84070

    Mr.ToR
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    ok, I’ve checked Ctrlr on different DAWs. Here are the results:

    macOS Sierra 10.12.6 on Mac Pro (Late 2013), 2.5 GHz 12-Core Intel Xeon E5, 64 GB 1866 MHz DDR3

    Reaper v5.70/64: VSTi & AUi Ctrlr major performance problem.
    Reaper v5.80/64: VSTi & AUi Ctrlr major performance problem.
    Reaper v5.80/32: VSTi & AUi Ctrlr major performance problem.
    Ableton Live v9.7.1 32bit: VST & AU Ctrlr major performance problem. (AU little better)
    Ableton Live v9.7.1 64bit: Ctrlr-VST works better but not perfectly smooth. Ctrlr-AU is ~acceptable.
    Ableton Live v10.0.1 64bit: Ctrlr-AU works perfectly smooth without any performance issue.
    Ableton Live v10.0.1 64bit: Ctrlr-VST shows major performance problems.
    Hosting AU v1.5.0 microDAW: Ctrlr-AU works perfectly smooth without any performance issue.
    Logic Pro X 10.4.1: Ctrlr-AU works perfectly smooth without any performance issue.
    Bitwig v2.2.2: Ctrlr-VST shows major performance problems.

    It seems that on Sierra Ctrlr has a major issue with its VST version.
    AU version seems to be doing good on some DAWs.
    None of these problems were present on OSX Yosemite 10.10.5

    So, Ctrlr is not working properly with Reaper and Bitwig on Sierra.
    However, Logic and Ableton is ok for the time being with AU only.

    #84071

    daimondamps
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    #84077
    Possemo
    Possemo
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    ok, I’ve checked Ctrlr on different DAWs. Here are the results:
    …snip

    Interesting findings. You write about 32bit versions. I thought that the Ctrlr Mac build is 64bit? But then it wouldn’t be possible to run the plugin on a 32bit DAW. So the newest Ctrlr Mac build is in fact 32bit?

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by Possemo Possemo.
    #84084

    Mr.ToR
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    You write about 32bit versions. I thought that the Ctrlr Mac build is 64bit? But then it wouldn’t be possible to run the plugin on a 32bit DAW. So the newest Ctrlr Mac build is in fact 32bit?

    I have been wondering that for some time now too. The same Ctrlr plugin for both AU and VST, work in 32-bit and 64-bit environments. I really don’t know how that happens. But the good news is that when you make a restricted instance, it works in both 32bit and 64bit environments too 🙂

    #84085

    Mr.ToR
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    Maybe Intel processor backdoor fix has something to do with this?
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/01/03/apple-has-already-partially-implemented-fix-in-macos-for-kpti-intel-cpu-security-flaw

    The article says apple partially addressed that issue on 10.13.2
    I’ve done these tests on 10.12.6
    Also, I’ve updated my laptop to 10.13.4 and the problem happens there too.
    So I don’t think that could be the problem.
    Ctrlr problems started with Sierra and High Sierra.

    I really wish atom would at least do a compatibility update for the Mac version of Ctrlr.
    I really have no problems with Ctrlr v5.3.198 on mac. I think it’s incredibly good for a free software. You only have to add images with Ctrlr v5.3.163 other than that Ctrlr v5.3.198 is perfect, well was perfect until Sierra happened.

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