JX-Programmer MKS-70 adaptation

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  • #44582
    opuswerk
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    Hello guys,

    Sorry for not replying earlier. I’ve become a father for the second time since starting this panel project, and I must say it’s taking a toll on my free time.

    The VST index is sorted, thanks to your script, but they’re not really bundled together. At least they start from 0 πŸ™‚

    I currently don’t have the PWM mod, and I won’t be installing it before a while. I believe the sysex controls are already well implemented, and might be complex and long to change. It would be much easier to script some Lua to replace the Hex strings in case the panel is connected to a JX10 instead of a MKS70. Hex is actually very easy to use with CTRLR, and I’d recommend sticking to it. It will also prevent you from re-writing all the Lua which uses the sent patch data to set all the sliders to their correct positions.

    I’ve re-organised the panel to something more compact and easier to use. See attached screenshot. I was thinking of maybe doing 2 panels for each voiceboard, which would make the panel even more compact, but I reckon I like having an overview of both boards at the same time.

    The latest version is attached hereunder. Please let me know how it goes for you.

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    #44612
    Possemo
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    Hi,

    Hex is actually very easy to use with CTRLR, and I’d recommend sticking to it. It will also prevent you from re-writing all the Lua which uses the sent patch data to set all the sliders to their correct positions.

    Ah I see. This is quite sophisticated. I have to say that I cannot test it because I am reorganizing my studio at the moment.

    So you guys won’t do the PWM-Mod and therefore won’t enhance the Ctrlr-Panel. No problem.

    @opuswerk
    : sure, there are sometimes more important things in live. Wish you and your family all the best.

    @superlewing
    : the mod is indeed not the easiest one. Desoldering the CPU worries me a bit too, but I have a good soldering/desoldering station which I think is mandatory.

    Here some copy/paste from the Gearslutz thread – for now that’s all I know about the additional features. To me it looks too good to be ignored:

    – 4 envelopes (2 multi-points, 2 ADSR), all loop-able (faster envelope *is subjective*, ask the beta testers)

    – new waveforms for the LFO

    – a 2nd LFO, can be modulated by LFO1 (and LFO2 can be modulated by LFO1, so you get LFO cross-mod)

    – DCO PWM waveform (if daughter boards are installed)

    Another quote where Quavermass is writing about faster envelopes:

    There are many parts to this answer…Firstly Fred has diched some of the timing that was imposed by the 100 percent utilised 8031 cpu (which could just about run the soundboards)…..the effects of this were that some voice updates got differing amounts of time to update the DAC/CV`s to drive the synth…thus some sloppy envelope action, there were other subtle artifacts which were found and cured with Freds new software which would lead you to think that the envelope software was to blame (DCO phase problems etc)

    Secondly..the “New” envelopes have the six stage Time/Level format, Identical to those in the Alpha Juno synths…with these you can set your own slope to the attack and decay times….I have found that a Zero attack to full on T1/L1 and playing with the T2/L2 for a very short decay to a lower level will give a nice MKS80 type “Spike” in your sounds…

    Finally the way all these new parameters interact with extra routings,LFO crossmod and LFO 1 AND 2 can be applied to the VCF (as well as aftertouch,velocity etc)..so a light touch on the parameter levels..and a little self control will make this synth sing…..start cranking things up and you will get some truly odd SFX type sounds or saturate the DAC/CV and end up with the same old JX stuff

    LFO can Free run,sync to first keypress or per keypress.

    #44616
    opuswerk
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    I’d actually love to do the PWM mod one day. But I believe i’ll need a good tech on this one. As my soldering skills are at a 0 level at the moment.

    The issue with updating the panel comes from the fact that I won’t be able to test it at all. But if you send me the layout and the sysex data, it shouldn’t be too difficult to implement roughly and let you edit it in a better way.

    Also, You can freely take the panel and update it yourself. Do not hesitate, but share the result with us afterwards πŸ˜‰

    http://opuswerk.tumblr.com
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    #44631
    Possemo
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    I would argue that soldering is much easier than programming a nice panel like yours πŸ˜‰ It really depends on the tool. I got this (german site but you get the point):

    http://www.elv.ch/profi-100-w-loet-entloetstation-lf-8800.html

    With this one soldering is a breeze. The desolder pump is great too. I wouldn’t want to desolder a chip without this. I am far from being a “good tech” – just a hobbyist. Anyway – I make you (of course superlewing too) the offer to do the soldering work if you want. Apart from desoldering the old CPU it seems quite an easy task. You just need a little patience. You would have to send the boards to switzerland (where I live).

    But lets take it slowly. I have to successfully mod my own MKS-70 first.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by Possemo.
    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by Possemo.
    #44639
    opuswerk
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    Now we’re talking! πŸ˜‰

    Keep me posted about your mod successes and we’ll see what we can do.
    Where are you based?

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    #44662
    Possemo
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    I do live in Bern the capital of Switzerland (no, the capital is not Zurich nor it is Interlaken πŸ™‚

    Looking forward to receive Fred’s kit. I will keep you informed. But I won’t hurry things. Although extensively betatested the PWM-kit is still an early bird. Actually there is just a basic wiring guide available. I attached it to this post, so you can look for yourself.

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    #44666
    opuswerk
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    Then we’re closer than I thought we were. I’m in Geneva, so not so far and most believe it’s the capital πŸ˜‰

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    #44695
    Possemo
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    Yeah, of course I forgot the french capital of our vast country – pardon monsieur :))

    #45207
    superlewing
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    Thanks for the panel opuswerk, it looks great.

    I’ve added a switch to link all lower tone modulators to the upper tone, making a single stereo patch in dual mode or a 24 oscillator monosynth in unison mode! It sets the value ‘manually’ first which might send too much sysex at once but resending the patch from ctrlr would sort it. The function also resets key mode (to dual), balance and chase but you could comment that out easily.

    The patch key mode sysex function was missing so that’s working now.

    The Upper DCO1 tune modulator had a vst index of 0 which bound it to the modulator with index 1 for some reason, so I’ve bumped it up to something unique.

    I’ve also changed the dynamics list items from numbers to soft, linear and exponential to make it easier to understand.

    The upper tone’s visible vst names now use less than 8 characters where possible to increase readability on ableton’s push.

    Seems to be working ok but please lemme know if I’ve missed anything.

    Possemo thanks for your offer of soldering, will have to see if the PWM sounds are worth the hassle of shipping from London the capital of England. As for the rest of the firmware I think it’ll be a while before I exhaust the MKS70’s myriad of parameters.

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    #45260
    opuswerk
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    Hello Superlewing,

    Great little update. Makes me think it’d be great to have a way to link Tone A with Tone B and keep the differences of the slaved Tone. In that way it’d become possible to to detune one patch against the other and keep that detuning when automating the master tone. I hope that makes sense.

    I’ll try it out with Push tonight when I get home. Very eager to get it on. My history with my MKS70 made it so I never really had the chance to learn it properly, but I’m betting a lot on this panel to get me out of this.

    I also want to delve in the LookAndFeel of CTRLR, so might try to change the colors when the link is activated. I’ve updated the panel, so that the Patch Key Mode gets updated on patch dumps.
    Not ALL parameters get updated now. Also, the After Touch control are missing of the panel, and some more. Shouldn’t take long once I’m with my MKS70. So i’ll get to those. I might be missing some sysex details here as not all params are shown in the latest manual.

    Btw, if someone can help on the GUI, it’d be great. Although I think the panel has become more useable as it is now. It could be more compact still…


    @Possemo
    : I’ll be in Bern next Tuesday. How did the PWM mod go? I want to order from Fred, but it seems he’s finished the batch already?

    xx edit xx
    Forgot to add the updated panel.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by opuswerk.
    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by opuswerk.
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    #45277
    superlewing
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    Yeah I just use the ‘dual detune’ control to accomplish that.

    I had to update the parameter numbering function to give priority to dynamic modulators , otherwise some go above 128 and ableton doesn’t pick them up. And yeah I noticed the essential aftertouch was missing too.

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    #45288
    Possemo
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    Hi, it is great to see you guys working on the panel.


    @superlewing
    : (Ah, another capital citizen)…Yes it’s true, the MKS-70 has already an impressive set of parameters. And yes I too definitely have still a lot to explore on how the parameters interact with each other.


    @opuswerk
    : I am waiting for the kit. It should be shipped shortly. Fred told he was quite overwhelmed by all the requests. So he is unsure what he will do when the first batch is finished. But I think there will be some way for people who absolutely want the kit. Also, I am still missing a comprehensive documentation of all the new features. We can meet on tuesday if you want, but I haven’t much to show you apart from a tiny studio that is an absolute mess. But maybe I can get some progress this weekend.

    #45290
    superlewing
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    Opuswerk, regarding keeping differences in the tone that’s a trivial matter of adding a new option to the listbox with a new ‘if’ section containing only the linking line.

    My drive for synchronising them when linked is that ableton only handles 128 parameters which doesn’t leave enough vst parameters to edit both tones, never mind what the mods would add.

    #45312
    dasfaker
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    In fact you are not limited to 128 parameters. Do a search in this forum about Ctrlr.overrides, it’s been explained a few times.

    #45357
    AnalogJunkie
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    Hi Guys
    I have a JX10 with Vecoven 3.02.

    Is teher any reason why this panel can’t work with the JX-10 with Vecoven software?

    I tested it out and could only get the patch change to work despite enabling SYSEX APR/IPR and CC parameter changes – basically “everything on” – I will investigate deeper with a MIDI utility in next few days as I’d like to understand why not.

    If it does need an extra setting adding, I am happy to help test out the JX10 side of things for you guys.
    So far this is the best control panel around, very impressive work.
    Cheers
    Guy

    #45392
    quadraspleen
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    So great to see this thread and panel still going! I’m opening the MKS up tomorrow and putting the Vecoven mod in.

    Well done to all of you who’ve been still beavering away refining the panel πŸ˜€

    #45437
    opuswerk
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    @AnalogJunkie:
    I’m using Vecoven’s Beta 3750 on my MKS70. I believe the unit number is also 24 for the JX10 ? If so the panel should work. Have you set the MIDI out in CTRLR correctly?

    I’m currently trying to figure out why I get so much sysex on patch dumps.
    Could anyone load a patch and paste the content of the sysex patch dump? You can easily do this by using the built-in MIDI monitor in CTRLR.

    For some reason I seem to be getting the Patch program data twice…

    Here’s a sample of a message I receive:

    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 30 01 3d 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 30 01 20 20 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 50 41 44 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 47 51 27 26 00 00 00 75 11 7f 00 5a 74 00 4d 01 05 00 01 00 42 00 00 4c 01 15 00 01 00 5a 01 1a 00 00 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d 39 4d 20 7f 40 f7]
    RAW:[c0 3d]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d 39 4d 20 7f 40 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 30 01 3d 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 30 01 20 20 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 50 41 44 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 47 51 27 26 00 00 00 75 11 7f 00 5a 74 00 4d 01 05 00 01 00 42 00 00 4c 01 15 00 01 00 5a 01 1a 00 00 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d

    and here again with some explanations:

    PATCH NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 30 01 3d 00 f7]
    PATCH NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 30 01 20 20 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 50 41 44 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 47 51 27 26 00 00 00 75 11 7f 00 5a 74 00 4d 01 05 00 01 00 42 00 00 4c 01 15 00 01 00 5a 01 1a 00 00 00 f7]

    TONE A NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    TONE A NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]

    TONE B NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    TONE B NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d 39 4d 20 7f 40 f7]

    BREAK ?
    RAW:[c0 3d]

    TONE A NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    TONE A NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]

    TONE B NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    TONE B NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d 39 4d 20 7f 40 f7]

    PATCH NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 30 01 3d 00 f7]
    PATCH NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 30 01 20 20 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 50 41 44 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 47 51 27 26 00 00 00 75 11 7f 00 5a 74 00 4d 01 05 00 01 00 42 00 00 4c 01 15 00 01 00 5a 01 1a 00 00 00 f7]

    TONE A NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 01 5a 00 f7]
    TONE A NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 01 4d 41 59 2e 53 20 57 49 4e 44 20 40 20 00 00 23 40 20 00 02 30 05 00 7f 7f 7f 60 60 6d 6d 3a 20 20 20 45 00 00 46 63 20 40 70 60 00 40 5e 63 00 15 00 5b 00 20 48 2a 21 20 7f 40 f7]

    TONE B NUMBER
    RAW:[f0 41 34 00 24 20 02 42 00 f7]
    TONE B NAME + PARAMETERS
    RAW:[f0 41 35 00 24 20 02 53 4f 55 4e 44 54 52 41 43 4b 20 20 60 00 00 00 20 60 00 02 30 00 00 7f 7f 7f 60 20 6d 6d 3a 20 20 00 34 00 00 3c 58 20 60 68 40 20 40 4e 67 7f 53 36 5b 00 50 6d

    This could be due to my beta OS. But i’d love someone to confirm this.

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    #45472
    Possemo
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    I finally got my mks70 connected to the pc. Had to fight with midi feedback loops on my old midiexpress but now it seems to work. This is really well done!

    @opuswerk
    : do you mean to load a patch with the editor and record the data? I did this. Textfile attached.

    Cheers

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    #45477
    opuswerk
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    Thanks for you dump Possemo.

    Could you please send a dump that starts with a program change you’d load from the MKS please? Will be a bit easier to compare.

    I’ve updated the panel, so that it behaves a bit better. The Lua was relaunching a bit too many things on every midi message received. So Filtered that a bit, in a nasty way though… But heh, it works.
    What I’ve couldn’t figure out unfortunately, was how to mute the program change messages that get sent on the panel updates. Those cause the whole panel to reload everything twice, and send sysex twice as well. Which is far less than optimal. If someone a bit more knowledgeable can pitch in here, i’d love some help.

    All the present parameters update to reflect the status of the synth now. If I missed something please let me know.

    My OS version doesn’t seem to be sending the KEY MODE value in the Patch APR. So I can’t get the correct values to finish the lua there. The code to update starts at line 14 of the assignPatchParamValues function.

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    #45567
    AnalogJunkie
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    • β˜…

    FYI
    Exchanged an email or two with Fred today on other things and i mentioned your panel. He responded with:
    “The key mode is indeed a weird one, because Roland sends it with 2 sysex. That guy could be missing this, I dont know. When the keymode is edited, their roland version should be updated too. (changing the key mode is not trivial)”
    That might give you a clue or two.

    Just trying to get the panel to work with my JX at moment…
    Cheers
    Guy

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