complex sysex messages – multiple DATA bytes (Roland)

[nozoku]

hi,

I’m doing a panel for Roland SH-32 and everything is going fine. but I have just come to a problem with sysex messages that are different from the other ones. here is Midi Implementation for SH-32: [url:26mmwb1p]http://media.rolandus.com/manuals/SH-32_MI.pdf[/url:26mmwb1p]. for example on page 8 – Patch INS-FX/INTENSITY and COLOR and RATE and LEVEL. how do I enter such sysex messages?

the global variables are really nice – I was able to do all parts in performance mode in one panel. great!

and while I was doing the panel I have found few things with the CTRLR – should I write them here or is there a special place for feature requests and so on ” title=”Smile” />?

[atom]

feature requests: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_ … id=1494008

complex sysex messages, depends on how complex. give me an example.

[nozoku]

[img:3sd5um6a]http://i52.tinypic.com/x5bkzk.png[/img:3sd5um6a]

normal sysex looks like this (for example INS-FX Type from the picture):

F0 41 10 00 4A 12 [adress] [adress] [adress] [adress] [data = xx] [checksum = I entered 46 and it worked with every sysex… don’t know why really ” title=”Wink” />] F7

but how I enter Intensity / Color / Rate? I’ve tried with [ms] [ls] but not sure what I’m doing really… I used sysex long time ago and I doing it mostly by trial and error now…

i’ve tried:
F0 41 10 00 4A 12 00 02 00 02 [ms] 00 00 [ls] 43 F7 – and other combinations but it’s not working correctly…

[atom]

this looks more complex that it should be, i think Roland split those message addresses and data into 4 parts instead of 2 you get upper byte, upper middle byte(wtf?), lower middle byte, lower byte.

i’d need to look at the actual device to say how this works, this manual is very bad

[nozoku]

I will try to decode the sysex message from MidiQuest XL which works with SH-32 and will get back here with the feedback. I’ve got it to work with Ctrlr, but not completly – must do some reverse engineering ” title=”Wink” />

and another question – is there a way to exclude a modulator from saving in a Program automatically? I want to save Programs without a Performance Part modulator (a "channel" in Performance mode (4-voice multitembral))…

and here is a nice document – [url:12oyxfiv]http://www.chromakinetics.com/handsonic/rolSysEx.htm[/url:12oyxfiv]. check the part "Settings with multiple DATA bytes". I will try to do that in Ctrlr later today when I will get back home from work.

[atom]

well i never thought you might want to NOT save a modulator, so such feature was never implemented, i can easily do that sure.

as for the sysex, with LUA inside Ctrlr you can do anything (or you will be able since i’m re-writing the LUA engine at the moment), the problem is that you must know what do you want to achieve.

[nozoku]

I will find a working sysex message and reverse engineer it or will try to get SH-32 to dump data and will dig into that. thanks for your help!

[atom]

i’d love to help more, cause thats why i got into this midi programming buisness to solve those vendor puzzles known as "midi implementations" and trust me that’s not the most complicated one i’ve seen.

it’s hard without the actual device that’s all.

[nozoku]

I see on SourceForge that you are maybe from Poland? jezeli z Warszawy to wziecie w obroty hardware’u nie jest nawet takie niemozliwe ” title=”Smile” />

[atom]

a ta poland ” title=”Smile” /> warszawa. let’s see what we can do without the hardware for now, maybe it won’t be that hard.

[nozoku]

” title=”Smile” /> I will fight with it later today. I think I have few options to get it right.

[nozoku]

ok, i’ve got it. the exemplary values look like this:

[b:3a1wu2yy]08 00 06 0e[/color:3a1wu2yy][/b:3a1wu2yy] 32878-32768=110
[b:3a1wu2yy]08 00 05 0c [/color:3a1wu2yy][/b:3a1wu2yy]32860-32768=92
[b:3a1wu2yy]08 00 00 00[/color:3a1wu2yy] [/b:3a1wu2yy]32768-32768=0
[b:3a1wu2yy]08 00 01 01[/color:3a1wu2yy][/b:3a1wu2yy] 32785-32768=17

and for values below 128 it’s simple – [08] [00] [ms] [ls]. it should be right.

but few of the effects have values up to 1000. for example:

[b:3a1wu2yy]08 03 0e 08[/color:3a1wu2yy][/b:3a1wu2yy] 33768-32768=1000

and now I don’t know how to implement it in Ctrlr…

and another question – the min and max values depend on the chosen effect (for example delay has another min and max values of the effect properties then distortion). is there a way to change the settings of one modulator according to value of another modulator? for example something like:

IF modulator1 = "REVERB" THEN modulator2.min=0 AND modualator2.max=127
IF modulator1= "DISTORITON" THEN modulator2.min=-63 and modulator2.max=63

or will it be possible with LUA? or is now possible? sorry I haven’t tried LUA yet…

[atom]

well the dependency between modulators must be done in LUA, there is really no intuitive graphical way to do this (or there is but i’m just unaware of such possibility)

as for the large values then i guess it’s not possible at the moment theese numbers are waay to big for normal midi manipulation, but i see that i should not give such small limits
to modulators (at the moment it was the max 14bit number that is in the MIDI Specs 16535 i never thought any vendor will go above this value). As always Roland amazes me with their
ideas for yet another dumbass MIDI implementation.

I’ll see about those large values maybe there is a quick fix.

[nozoku]

thanks for all the help!

[nozoku]

I see that in a newest revision I can make the modulator to use the values up to 65536 but how can I put it in a sysex message? or was it always there…

I want to put values from 32768 to 32895… so i need numbers from 0 to 1000 really…

[atom]

well no it wasn’t there now it is, there are 4 roland type splits in the sysex editor, but i need to make them work, i’m not 100% sure if i got it right yet so it’s not working but it will be there.

[atom]

you should check build 479 and try those large values, i tried it with the examples given in the SH32 manual and it seems to work, but i can’t be sure, i don’t know what sysex values to expect at integer values > 32000 so this is a stab in the dark (ouch)

[nozoku]

the message is:
F0 41 10 00 4a 12 k0 k1 04 06 [b:3rpnjlo8]xx xx xx xx[/b:3rpnjlo8][/color:3rpnjlo8] 46 f7

the numbers are from 32768 to 33768, so I really need:

F0 41 10 00 4a 12 k0 k1 04 06 [b:3rpnjlo8]08 xx xx xx[/b:3rpnjlo8][/color:3rpnjlo8] 46 f7

as I checked the sysex sent by the unit it’s like:

for 0:
F0 41 10 00 4a 12 k0 k1 04 06 [b:3rpnjlo8]08 00 00 00[/b:3rpnjlo8][/color:3rpnjlo8] 46 f7

for 127 (7F):
F0 41 10 00 4a 12 k0 k1 04 06 [b:3rpnjlo8]08 00 07 0F[/b:3rpnjlo8] [/color:3rpnjlo8]46 f7

for 1000 (03E8):
F0 41 10 00 4a 12 k0 k1 04 06 [b:3rpnjlo8]08 03 0E 08[/b:3rpnjlo8][/color:3rpnjlo8] 46 f7

hope it helps – I can test it on my SH-32… thanks for all the work on this!

[nozoku]

"atom":1qzw0qsb wrote:

you should check build 479 and try those large values, i tried it with the examples given in the SH32 manual and it seems to work, but i can’t be sure, i don’t know what sysex values to expect at integer values > 32000 so this is a stab in the dark (ouch)[/quote:1qzw0qsb]

how can I enter them into the sysex?

[atom]

r1 r2 r3 r4, just right click on a byte and there will be a popup menu with a list.

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