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Hi all!
Is there a way I can use MIDI to send info from my synth to CTRLR so I can analyze and deconstruct a patch?
I’d like to change the patch on my Virus and CTRLR automatically configure all values to match the patch, I feel I could learn a lot about syntheses this way.
I assume I would need MIDI from synth to ctrlr for which I need a patch bay, but I won’t get one if it isn’t possible.
From the Ctrlr side it’s definitely possible, my panel for the DW8000 does that, I just have to send a specific sysex message and it sends the current patch’s settings in a big sysex message.
Check your synth’s midi implementation if it can send a dump of a given patch.
Thanks Liam. What’s the message you need to send to the synth?
I have a Virus B, I can dig out all the SysEx commands if you need them.
By a quick look at the Virus B manual I found online the Virus B seems to be able to send its patches in a sysex dump, look from page 255 on the english manual. Gonna be quite some work to implement that tho as there’s a lot of parameters apparently.
You can of course use Ctrlr at the end for analyzing MIDI data, but (correct me if I’m wrong) MIDIOX (for windows) is also a great help for learning what is going on with MIDI in and out. For Mac I’m using Sysex Librarian, but that program is (only?) OK for getting sysex dumps.
I still need help with this one.
I checked the manual and I’m still unsure how to request a midi dump from the Virus to CTRLR.
Is it the total dump command? Even if I figured it out, I have no idea how to program CTRLR I’m a total newbie at this.
I don’t own a Virus, but looked at the manual (Access Virus Manual v4 as pdf) and on page 255 you will find the information about which sysex command to send to the Virus to request a Single Dump (for one preset). On page 258 all the parameters are explained. With CTRLR you can put a button on the canvas and assign the single dump sysex command to this button. Click this button and Virus will send the requested data. The incoming data you can monitor with the Midi Monitor window of CTRLR. The next step is writing a Lua script for the incoming midi data. This script will be called when CTRLR receives midi messages (see attached screenprint) and should analyze and assign parameter values to modulators. BUT it will be a heck of a job to assign each parameter value within the dump to a different modulator! (I hope I’m right about this, otherwise please correct me!) So the most important thing is to study the Virus manual and learn about MIDI (sysex) and then learn about scripting in Lua. All this took me about 2 months (and still learning and making mistakes!), mainly because you’re pretty much on your own in this matter.
There is no tutorial about how to start with CTRLR and Lua. All you can do is study the demo panels, the threads on this forum and ask questions (as specific as possible). The author of CTRLR (he calls himself ‘atom’) answers most of the time these questions, as a few other forum members do occasionally.
The main problem (IMHO) is that everyone has his own device for which he/she wants to develop a panel and each device (especially the older/retro ones) are sometimes unique in the way they have implemented MIDI, so the questions about these devices are most of the time only of interest for a very few people on this forum.
Sometimes I wish there was a manual for Ctrlr, but then i guess it would lose part of the fun eheh 🙂
It’s like digging for gold.If you find it you are very happy, but few people are willing to share the gold they have found. Luckily not everybody is like this and that’s what’s keeping these forums interesting and a source of gold. That is what open source software is all about!
Quote:
With CTRLR you can put a button on the canvas and assign the single dump sysex command to this button. Click this button and Virus will send the requested data. The incoming data you can monitor with the Midi Monitor window of CTRLR. The next step is writing a Lua script for the incoming midi data. This script will be called when CTRLR receives midi messages (see attached screenprint) and should analyze and assign parameter values to modulators. BUT it will be a heck of a job to assign each parameter value within the dump to a different modulator! (I hope I’m right about this, otherwise please correct me!) So the most important thing is to study the Virus manual and learn about MIDI (sysex) and then learn about scripting in Lua. All this took me about 2 months (and still learning and making mistakes!), mainly because you’re pretty much on your own in this matter. Unquote
£25 paypal gift to anyone who can make this happen for me 🙂
I’d like to correct a misunderstanding.
You are not on your own when it comes to programming itself, i’ll help with the API there are many example panels and every panel that uses Lua is also an example panel since they are all open source.
he only thing you are on your own is understanding your synth’s manual. Even here if you can find someone who has the same synth and can help you with understanding how the SysEx dumps work in that device, you can count on some help.
I also like to correct a misunderstanding 😉 I know atom you help a lot with the programming stuff and I appreciate it very much, you can be sure of that! But I meant more the LEARNING part of CTRLR/Juce and Lua. This is IMHO what you have to do mainly for yourself.
Well i see that most of people expect Ctrlr to be a maigc program and be able to do program dumps on ANY device without any logic to it.
It’s impossible, no program can do that, the ones that do it base their algorithms on predefined databases of devices built over years. There is no automatic way of doing that, you can’t write an algorithm that would cover all program dump possibilities, you can’t write a program that would cover half of what’s out there (20% maybe).
Well i see that most of people expect Ctrlr to be a maigc program and be able to do program dumps on ANY device without any logic to it.
I agree with you here, Ctrlr is a tool that we must use it to reach our target, and the dumps are part of our target.
But I’ve missed some guide on planning and optimizing the panels as you know Ctrlr better than anybody.
Well i need to have all the parts i need for a guideline. So far the MIDI Library is not working and without it stating how i see the future of Ctrlr and how to develop panels is an empty statement. But i will do that, i will create a video tutorial when i’m done with that part, how to create a panel from scratch and implement all the components of it, witch i think are
1) parameter live edit
2) program/bank send/receive from/to device
3) snapshot send to device
4) custom data send/receive from/to device
5) publishing and maintananceUpdate. I just booted ctrlr for the first time in a while. I opened my Virus panel and inspected it from top to bottom and lo and behold, a huge button in the centre of the panel labelled
MIDI DUMP REQUEST
*facepalm*
In my defence, I probably never noticed it until now because I didn’t have the proper MIDI connections to use it.
Anyway, tried it, works like a charm. (takes about a second and a half)
Much thanks to Widy for creating an amazing panel and atom for creating an awesome program.
And thanks to all who have helped out a complete idiot. 🙂
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